Lt Gen Ajai Kumar Singh at Idea Exchange: ‘Lesson from Russia-Ukraine war…India must always be prepared for conventional conflict’

Another thing is technology. For example, the way drone warfare is unfolding is simply amazing. Then cyber warfare and battle of narratives. The way the battle of narratives is unfolding has a very important lesson for us. How should we chalk out our strategy for a strategic information campaign?

Another important aspect is logistics. When the war goes on for a long period, how well are we prepared? Another key issue is self reliance, atma nirbharta. India is today at the cusp and we are saying that it’s amrit kaal. Atma nirbharta in terms of weaponry and critical technologies is also crucial. There is also a focus from the government on these aspects.

SUSHANT KULKARNI: On the issue of atma nirbharta, how challenging is it for the Armed Forces to shift from import dependence to reliance on indigenous products?

Any shift is challenging. But we are absolutely convinced that this is the right shift. This shift should have possibly come earlier. We, as Armed Forces, have to play a very constructive and positive role in this. While the government supports in terms of policy and budget, we will have to do the hand holding. The way I look at it as Southern Army Commander is, how can I play the role of a coordinator or a catalyst in this quest for self reliance. The shift would not be difficult when we consider the fact that weapons are weapons. The challenge is this interim period and we have to conserve and maintain whatever is there with us. A lot of our equipment is of Russian origin and spares have to come from there. So, now it is time for us to make sure how self-reliant we are even in taking care of the Russian equipment. I am happy to state that especially here in the Southern Command, we have set out to play a proactive role in this shift. We are ready to tide over a period of transition without affecting our operational preparedness.

In our country, we say shakti is feminine… I am glad that this shakti is increasingly becoming part of the organisation… Today, we have Permanent Commission for women and there are women in leadership roles

ANURADHA MASCARENHAS: What is the timeframe that we are looking at for this transition?

I am looking at a window of maybe five to 10 years, but when I say that, there is a lot that has already started fructifying. It is an issue of joining dots. I see a lot of dynamism in the industry. So when I say five years plus, possibly I see a lot of scope that we can telescope because it is important for us. There is a Regional Technology Node, the RTN, that is operational in our headquarters in Pune. We started with SAI-square — Southern Star Army Academia Industry Interface. Earlier, it was challenging for the industry to reach out to us, it is a thing of the past now. The experts on subjects like ordnance, artillery are with us. So, if the industry needs help in terms of expertise, testing ranges, we will help out.

Whenever something new comes up, there will always be some anxiety. I am happy to tell you that Agniveer has worked extremely well. The kind of motivation they (the Agniveer recruits) have is simply amazing

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PARTHA SARTHI BISWAS: Speaking about lessons from Ukraine-Russia, you talked of civil military fusion. What did you mean by that?

Today, in the civil domain, there are lots of capabilities that the country has. For example in terms of border infrastructure, in the two states of Rajasthan and Gujarat, the infrastructure upgrades that have taken place are phenomenal. Today, we have the Bharatmala (road development project) going right to the forward areas. Earlier, we used to have a nodal concept of defence. There were only limited roads and tracks. Our strategy was that you deny road access, so important towns used to be held as a node. But today we have the Bharatmala project and the western freight corridor. My point is how can we leverage the capabilities that the country has for defence purpose. When we got the national logistics policy, security was not a very important constituent of that initially but we were able to retrofit it. We reached out to the Ministry of Commerce and Industry and held a seminar on civil-military fusion and got very good feedback.

In our country, we say shakti is feminine… I am glad that this shakti is increasingly becoming part of the organisation… Today, we have Permanent Commission for women and there are women in leadership roles

AJAY SHANKAR: Recently, we had an incident of a senior DRDO scientist being allegedly trapped through social media (in an espionage case in Pune where the Southern Command is also based). Has this prompted any specific thinking within your establishment on how to tackle this? Are you thinking of any new measures? Is there a new awareness move being planned?

It has really affected us and we have taken note of it in a very major manner. This has always been one of our core concerns — social media, cases of honey trapping, because we are aware that both China and Pakistan use these to their advantage. And especially Pakistan… they have a robust organisation and their sole purpose is this, how do we reach out to the Armed Forces and others, directly and indirectly, gain access, and then honeytrap and extract information. So we are very conscious of this. The Armed Forces and the Army, in particular, the Southern Army, has taken a large number of steps in this direction.

One is that we have to continuously make people aware, the rank and file, because it is a dynamic which keeps changing… units will come, units will go… So there are internal audits, surprise checks, external audits, and also a number of exercises, which we call cyber fortress exercises… The lessons are shared… I don’t think there is any system which is absolutely foolproof. But it’s a dynamic process, and we continuously keep trying to find out what your vulnerabilities are and how do you plug (them). I would say we are in a very good state today and we are able to take care of our systems.

I think a soldier has to be spiritual. There is… distinction between being spiritual and being religious… (Spirituality) is the science of understanding who I am. If I don’t understand myself, how am I to do anything else

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MANOJ MORE: Other than Pakistan and China indulging in honey trapping, is it common worldwide? Does India also resort to it?

I would say it is pretty common worldwide. We always believe in the Chanakya Niti of ‘Saam, daam, dhand, bhed’… we have to use anything and everything to protect our sovereignty and to ensure the integrity of our country.

I think a soldier has to be spiritual. There is… distinction between being spiritual and being religious… (Spirituality) is the science of understanding who I am. If I don’t understand myself, how am I to do anything else

ATIKH RASHID: It’s been a year since the Agnipath scheme was launched. How has the scheme fared so far? There were protests largely because of anxieties among the prospective jawans about employment benefits. It was said that it would affect the kind of people you get. Have you seen any change in the quality of recruits?

Change is the only constant. Whenever something new comes up, there will always be some anxiety. I am happy to tell you that Agniveer has worked extremely well. The kind of motivation that they (recruits) have is simply amazing. Josh (enthusiasm) and jazba (passion) are there… We have telescoped the training time, increased the number of some modules and periods, and taken out some theory areas because some things can be best learnt on the job. As of date, we are extremely happy.

The  second and important stage would be when the recruit joins the unit and starts working. To that extent, we have had a lot of iterations and have worked out the modalities. Like we are telling the Agniveers that when you go back, you will continue to be a rashtra veer. This particular scheme is a win-win situation. If you are absorbed, you become a part of the great Indian Army and if you do not get absorbed, there’s nothing to be lost. You have been trained for four years. In this period, that person would have imbibed the principles and discipline of the organisation. They are receiving sufficient money, and the government has taken many steps to ensure a smooth transition. As of today, 10 per cent reservation for them has been announced by BSF, CRPF and CISF and Railways have committed to 15 per cent reservation. Discussions are also being held with the industry.

Whenever something new comes up, there will always be some anxiety. I am happy to tell you that Agniveer has worked extremely well. The kind of motivation they (the Agniveer recruits) have is simply amazing

ANURADHA MASCARENHAS: Armed Forces are taking initiatives to encourage women to join. What are the challenges for women, especially in leadership and operational areas?

You are aware that women are inducted in around 10 streams in the Army, ranging from engineers, army air defence, ordnance, intelligence and now combat support artillery, in addition to medical corps and nursing services. We, as an organisation, also have to change the mindset. Once you keep your mind open, your mindset also changes. I am actually witness to this change. In our country, we say that shakti (might) is feminine. When armed forces represent the shakti of the country, we needed this particular shakti. I am glad that this shakti is increasingly becoming part of the organisation. I can assure you that the mindset is changing fast. Today, we have Permanent Commission for women and there are women in leadership roles.

We had the (selection) board for them, and since it was happening for the first time, we had to tweak policies… the boards will be gender neutral. It will be a level playing field. I am absolutely relying on our capacity and adaptability to change.

ATIKH RASHID: On the Agniveer scheme, there are fears that those who aren’t absorbed in the services will lead to the militarisation of society after they go back.

Not at all. There are very large proportions of Indian Army soldiers who retire quite early. The Armed Forces really transform you. There could be exceptions, but they do not form the rule. It is important that the transition to something meaningful and constructive takes place quickly.

SUSHANT KULKARNI: With Southern Command’s geographical setting and institutional mix, it is an ideal example of jointness and tri-services integration. How will the journey be towards the formation of theatre commands?

I will not talk about the theaterisation because it is something that is happening, and in the right manner. But on Southern Command, you are right in saying that. We are in peninsular India. Most of the Air Commands and all Naval Commands are co-located with the Southern Command and we have a very good equation with them. We have regular interactions. Southern Command becomes an ideal testing ground for both jointness and integration. To that extent, we have covered a lot of ground.

CHANDAN HAYGUNDE: The Army has never been in a direct armed battle against Naxals. How does the Army look at left-wing extremism (LWE) and its changing tactics?

You correctly pointed out that as far as LWE is concerned, we are not directly involved. On the point about the changing contours, we are monitoring the situation closely. We interact with our counterparts from various agencies and there is sharing of information. Preemptive and proactive measures on how we insulate ourselves is a dynamic process.

 DIPANITA NATH: What is your message to those people who are always trying to declare wars with neighbouring countries on your behalf on social media?

I think social media is a very democratic space. If people want to say something, they will vent their feelings. But, being a responsible citizen is important because whatever you put out there reaches the world at large. It shows your values, principles and ethics.

I think it is very important that citizens become a part of an ecosystem that says that this is my nation and I stand for my nation. My actions should not degrade its values.

AJAY JADHAV: There are plans of dissolving Cantonment Boards and merging them with nearest local civic bodies. What is your opinion on that?

Cantonments are carried on from the British era. Today, they are in the middle of the city, like in Pune. We have to tweak a little so that civilians who are there in the Cantonment continue to benefit from the schemes of the state and central government. Also, we have to introspect whether we have been able to give the civilians, who are staying in the Cantonment, their dues. Have I been able to give them accessibility and other facilities? How do we reorient the Cantonment Boards in tune with the present reality is important. Towards that, Southern Army has taken lots of steps. We need large areas for troops to practise, rehearse, and carry out maneuvers. None of our area must lie vacant and we must use it productively. Wherever you go in India, the Cantonments are like an oasis. If Pune people are breathing easily, I think it is thanks to the Cantonment.

AJAY JADHAV: Do you mean that Cantonment Boards should be retained?

I would not make a statement on that. I can say that today we are in a position where we can make Cantonment Boards work effectively.

SHALMALI BHAGWAT: The ‘Sahayak’ system in the Indian Army was heavily criticised in 2022 after two videos surfaced on social media. The Supreme Court had shot down a PIL in favour of abolishing the system in 2022. What are your thoughts on the same and do you think the internal working of the Indian Army needs a change?

The ‘buddy’ system in the Indian Army is time-tested and extremely important to the functioning of the Army. There is a lot of misinformation regarding this system. It is not a servant-master relation, but one where both are buddies.

Buddies fight with us in wars and other operations and enable a commander to think, plan, coordinate and execute. Having said that, I believe we should take care that this system is not misutilised. I think there has not been a single case of the buddy system being misused in the Southern Command. There are stories galore on how a buddy has saved an officer and an officer has saved a buddy. It is a profound relationship.

DIPANITA NATH: You have spoken about the spiritual soldier. Aren’t spirituality and being a soldier on opposite ends of the spectrum?

In the Bhagavad Gita, Krishna tells Arjun to pick up the gandiva and fight. Fight for what? For what is right. That is why I say that, as a soldier, we have to fight to protect values. It is for no other reason that Guru Gobind Singh created the Khalsa Panth. Its soldiers are known the world over for their soldierly prowess and correctness in battle. I think, essentially, a soldier has to be deeply spiritual. There is an absolute distinction between being spiritual and being religious. What is spirituality? It’s the science of understanding who I am. If I do not understand myself, how am I supposed to do anything else?

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DIPANITA NATH: Do you incorporate spiritual practices and meditation in the Army routine?

Yes because it helps calm the mind. War is the most stressful situation. Anything and everything that can calm you is helpful. So we are trying all means such as meditation and yoga. The practice of yoga, the complete eight-fold path of it, has been recognised worldwide.